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Is this cast fitting weldable easy ?

MoonRise

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Couple of things.

That 'fitting' at Target is for the steam-punk/industrial decor look for things like shelves and brackets and such. They LOOK like pipe fittings but they usually aren't RATED as actual pipe fittings. Beware.

Next, 275 gpm through 3" nominal pipe.

Eek.

Your flow velocity through the pipe is ~2+ times what best practices call for regarding flow velocities. 😵

You are going to have flow erosion problems on the pressure side and probably cavitation problems on the suction side. Noisy operation, increased erosion wear on the piping, increased risk of cavitation and wear on the pump (cavitation wrecks pumps!), not good at all for continuous operation at that flow rate and flow velocity. Marginal operation even for an intermittent use case, such as fire sprinkler system.

At 275 gpm, better practice would be to use at least 4" nominal piping, long sweep elbow and not a street elbow, and still check flow rates and fluid velocity for the complete flow system. If this is a recirculating fluid system, also check for suction reservoir size and settling time to minimize possible air entrainment in the fluid.

Check your fluid system design some more, because 3" pipe and 275 gpm isn't really right.

You said you wanted to weld the street elbow to some steel plate, but then later said the the elbow is going into a round section (tapping into another pipe?). What's going on? I think there may be more to consider than just how to weld a fitting.
 
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PCustoms

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Couple of things.

That 'fitting' at Target is for the steam-punk/industrial decor look for things like shelves and brackets and such. They LOOK like pipe fittings but they usually aren't RATED as actual pipe fittings. Beware.

Not that I would, but


1777149481248.jpeg
 

Crazyjake8493

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I've TIG brazed malleable iron fittings like that several times with success. Never tried to weld it, I don't think that would ever be the best solution, but I'm not a metallurgist.
 
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sweetk30

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Couple of things.

That 'fitting' at Target is for the steam-punk/industrial decor look for things like shelves and brackets and such. They LOOK like pipe fittings but they usually aren't RATED as actual pipe fittings. Beware.

Next, 275 gpm through 3" nominal pipe.

Eek.

Your flow velocity through the pipe is ~2+ times what best practices call for regarding flow velocities. 😵

You are going to have flow erosion problems on the pressure side and probably cavitation problems on the suction side. Noisy operation, increased erosion wear on the piping, increased risk of cavitation and wear on the pump (cavitation wrecks pumps!), not good at all for continuous operation at that flow rate and flow velocity. Marginal operation even for an intermittent use case, such as fire sprinkler system.

At 275 gpm, better practice would be to use at least 4" nominal piping, long sweep elbow and not a street elbow, and still check flow rates and fluid velocity for the complete flow system. If this is a recirculating fluid system, also check for suction reservoir size and settling time to minimize possible air entrainment in the fluid.

Check your fluid system design some more, because 3" pipe and 275 gpm isn't really right.

You said you wanted to weld the street elbow to some steel plate, but then later said the the elbow is going into a round section (tapping into another pipe?). What's going on? I think there may be more to consider than just how to weld a fitting.
Read my replys . I said those flow rates are full power rpm . We do not run it this high as its not fun holding on to the hose . And no need to flow that much that fast .

And the round item is just formed plate steel . Its a filter pot housing .

And others use these same parts and combos of name brand built units and get STUPID money for the same thing i can build .

Thanks for the help tho 😎
 

MoonRise

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OK. Malleable iron fitting are generally considered NOT Weldable for most cases.

Because the heat of welding changes the iron structure from Malleable to brittle. Which means it will likely crack, sooner or later.

Some limited exceptions for non-structural, non-critical, non-pressurized, non-vibration cases might exist. Your use case doesn't really seem to fit any of those.

Possible options:
Thread the fitting in, use a weldable bung or coupler/nut, maybe braze it, find a steel fitting, rethink how you want/need/can plumb things, bend your suction pipe into an integral long-sweep elbow and cut the threads off and weld the pipe to where it needs to go, etc.

But don't weld that Malleable iron fitting.

If you give us limited or conflicting info, our answers or suggestions might not be all that good. 😉

(you said 275 gpm flow and 3" fitting and showed a street elbow in the picture, a couple of us flagged that info as a problem area. If you're not running at 275 gpm then don't tell us 275 gpm.)

🍺
 

whateg01

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If you give us limited or conflicting info, our answers or suggestions might not be all that good. 😉

(you said 275 gpm flow and 3" fitting and showed a street elbow in the picture, a couple of us flagged that info as a problem area. If you're not running at 275 gpm then don't tell us 275 gpm.)

🍺
Fully agree, but I design stuff for worst case scenarios. So while it's not intended to be used at full power all the time, I would say if that's the most demand it might see, that's what it should be designed for. So, yes, **** info given, but since it's possible for that **** condition to expose, that's what it should be capable of supporting, imo.
 

MoonRise

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Fully agree, but I design stuff for worst case scenarios. So while it's not intended to be used at full power all the time, I would say if that's the most demand it might see, that's what it should be designed for. So, yes, **** info given, but since it's possible for that **** condition to expose, that's what it should be capable of supporting, imo.

Absolutely agree. If the motor and pump can support 275 gpm, then the rest of the system (piping, fittings, reservoir, etc) MUST be able to support at LEAST 275 gpm.

You don't want your pump to cavitate and destroy itself because your suction line couldn't support what the pump needed. That gets expensive. 🤣 You don't want the pressure side plumbing to beat itself to destruction because it couldn't support the flow rate the pump was pushing through it. That gets expensive too. 😭 Etc.

And just because you realize not to turn the system up to full power, there's nothing to stop someone else from running it at full power and causing the system to destroy itself.

Design the system so that the components support the needs and goals, and the expensive pump is not being inadvertently used as the sacrificial fuse.

🍺
 
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Firebrick43

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Nope . . Same plan but the honda is the power for the hydro drive to feed the pump and mixer shaft . And we free flow the liquid not pressureize it .
I thought that was a 5gpm pump?

Some pressure has to be built or no work will be done as pressure is going to produce the torque in the motor. Most systems are not going to operate well under 800 psi with common size motors and valve.

Even 100 psi at 275gpm is going to take approximately 36 hp to run the pump
 

welder4956

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I've TIG brazed malleable iron fittings like that several times with success. Never tried to weld it, I don't think that would ever be the best solution, but I'm not a metallurgist.
I am a metallurgist and I agree. If it is pumping to an open ended pipe with no valves that could be used to stop flow, it will probably work fine with TIG brazing. If there is a shutoff valve, the risk is it could break and be leaking water everywhere. But if it is in the great outdoors and not capable of flooding a building or spraying on electric lines, that might be OK. But why take chances, just get a steel pipe ****** or half coupling, or a steel elbow and weld it to whatever you're trying to connect to.
 
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sweetk30

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I thought that was a 5gpm pump?

Some pressure has to be built or no work will be done as pressure is going to produce the torque in the motor. Most systems are not going to operate well under 800 psi with common size motors and valve.

Even 100 psi at 275gpm is going to take approximately 36 hp to run the pump
honda with now upgraded 15gpm hydro pump . this will feed the hydro motor that is coupled to the 3" fluid pump i am powering with it . same type of system is used this way on a lot of these units . but the factory built stuff has no specs so i am going off what others have used for hydro motors and good results with .

the 275 gpm is the max flow rate full rpm of the fluid pump i am powering with the 190rpm/3,850in lb torque hydro motor .
 

Firebrick43

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Ok, so this is a hydraulic powered water pump? I assume a centrifugal impeller pump?

I think a lot of people were under the impression it was a hydraulic pump itself and why they were so concerned about cavitation.
 

PCustoms

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Ok, so this is a hydraulic powered water pump? I assume a centrifugal impeller pump?

I think a lot of people were under the impression it was a hydraulic pump itself and why they were so concerned about cavitation.

If I'm reading correctly, gas-->hydraulic pump-->hydraulic motor-->"fluid pump"

Seems like an awful lot of inefficient energy transfer in the middle
 

Firebrick43

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If I'm reading correctly, gas-->hydraulic pump-->hydraulic motor-->"fluid pump"

Seems like an awful lot of inefficient energy transfer in the middle
Hydraulics are never the choice for pure theoretical efficiency. The flexibility, smoothness, compact drives, and variable speed for many machines can lead to an efficiency of motion which increase productivity
 
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sweetk30

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Wow . . Good de-rail of the thread as normal . . 😵‍💫

Picture is basic layout for mock-up some tweaking to come .

But it is a fluid pump BOWIE brand . Has rubber tip gears and is a monster @ 135lbs by its self . https://bowiepumps.com/products/signature-series/signature-3300/

This is all the same basic design as others just my version of it all . And most name brand makers of this type of stuff remove the info tags to keep you from just grabbing them your self .

But back to the original weld on fitting question . We have a lot of good info and i have made my choice and will be cutting out and moving the original fitting and cap the old hole location .
 

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PCustoms

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Wow . . Good de-rail of the thread as normal . . 😵‍💫

Crazy what happens when people post disjointed details across multiple threads, isn't it?

Picture is basic layout for mock-up some tweaking to come .

But it is a fluid pump BOWIE brand . Has rubber tip gears and is a monster @ 135lbs by its self . https://bowiepumps.com/products/signature-series/signature-3300/

This is all the same basic design as others just my version of it all . And most name brand makers of this type of stuff remove the info tags to keep you from just grabbing them your self .

But what is it?
 
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sweetk30

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Crazy what happens when people post disjointed details across multiple threads, isn't it?



But what is it?
i asked a specific question in this post . go back to post #1 . its not my fault people wana play games and twist stuff all around .

i am not the one injecting stuff from my other posts .

and what does it matter what my project is ? maybe when i am all done and get it filled and working i will do a post on it and some of the detailed help i have gotten here .

sorry for my rant but this place is way worse on de-railed posts than the FEW other places i am on . there is a reason i dont post much here cause of this fact .
 
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sweetk30

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Well final outcome is here . After moving stuff around and making it all fit best possible i found if i made a flange and welded it to the already welded fitting on the filter pot it would just clear my mounting spot . So some 1/2" plate and welded set on liquify and she fits with 1" gap for servicing .

Thanks for all those who helped and gave good info to learn from and make the choice .
 

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