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Zone 6/Minnesota - minisplit vs natural gas for maintaining ~50F in winter?

OP
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Nov 21, 2025
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You should care about SEER ! It directly affects your electric bill !

The issue is, how many additional years will a higher SEER/more expensive model take to "pay back". Difficult to calculate !
SEER is only for cooling efficiency, which I do not care about. HSFP2 Region V is a more telling number for heating efficiency in MN.

Any "open flame" (not vented) LP/Nat Gas releases both CO and H2O ! Run a "not dog" for a long time and you will be dripping !

If you decide to go gas, at least get a vented wall mount furnace.

Every ceiling mounted forced air heater I've seen so far is vented.
 
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WisJim

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I have found that I need to run a dehumidifier from March to November in my shop in Western Wisconsin to keep tools from rusting. I'm considering a mini-split for heat and dehumidification and occasionally cooling. Then I would have everything in one unit and in the long run it would be more efficient and cheaper to operate than using a dehumidifier and electric space heating. Gas heat would be hard to add but I have enough solar panels to add to offset the electric usage.
 

pcmeiners

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I have found that I need to run a dehumidifier from March to November in my shop in Western Wisconsin to keep tools from rusting. I'm considering a mini-split for heat and de humidification and occasionally cooling.
This was a major priority for me, I hate rust. Minisplits work great on humidity, aside from the wonderful feeling of having dry air in the spring to late fall to work in. As to cost to run for my 30x26 shop in central PA it costs about 15-$20 per month to heat, A/C is cheaper, that is with a night turn down temperature of 62° and I am not in the shop every day. Don't blame you not caring about SEEER, when heat costs 4x more than A/C, especially in your local.
 

finn

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I'm originally from Michigan,
but have lived in Kentucky for the last 13 years. I can confidently say I don't need the mini split for cooling!
We put mini splits in the house in the UP. Totally worth it!

The shop has 16’ ceilings though. Not many uncomfortable days working in there as long as it’s not mosquito season and you can open the big doors.

The bugs are typically gone by August when the heat sets in..
 

PoorUB

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Edit: Just read your update about wood working in the shop - is that a consideration when using an open flame heater? Dust in the air I mean?
To have enough dust in the air to be a concern the air would be so thick you probably wouldn't survive out there!

How do you think wood shop are heated in the frozen north? I used to do HVAC service and did repairs at a couple commercial cabinet shops in the area. They were heated various brands of gas units heaters. I would open up a gas until heater and it would have 3"-4" inches of saw dust in the bottom. Often it would have burn marks in the dust from the heat from the burners. Some times the circuit boards were cover with inches of saw dust. I would take my little shop vac I carried and vac it all out and get the heat going and move onto the next one.

I'm not saying it was perfectly safe, just saying what happens in the real world.

I do woodworking in my shop. I do use a dust collector and a air filter. There is virtually no dust in the air so proper use of dust handling and they can be fairly clean. I run an 80% furnace with a split AC, but a good air filter. I still would question the use of a mini split in a wood shop. I would think that monthly coil cleanings would be required if the shop was used regularly.
 

fitter30

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A heat pump just moves "heat" (energy) from one place to another. I know, it is hard to comprehend that there is "heat" in outsi
Apples to apples the same heating btu their going to heat the same. But how many hp are designed for a heating load. With gas the efficiency doesn't drop when its cold outside 98% hp do lose btu's as temps drop even the -22° except 1 or 2 high end hyper heat brands. You are assuming electricity is cheaper even with the hp efficiency. Saw e. bill for Michigan electric use was like $60 and the delivery/ demand charge was $230 because they are upgrading there introstructure. Electric companies for years have been giving commercial and industrial businesses massive breaks for upgrades for efficiency. Homes in big cities gave out cfl bulbs then led. Thermostats that they control in peak hours and rebates for windows ,roof and insulation. The reason electrical plants cost billions and upgrading the distribution grid. Just to keep from doing the work and spending the money. Now data centers come in play using a gigawatt from a power plant and have to do it. We the people have to pay for most or all of it. Either as it's being built or after.
 

e-tek

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$2.00/foot for my propane company to run a line from my house to the new sauna, plus the second regulator, which was $50 Or $60.

I don’t know where your $2000 came from. It would be $250 for me, and I don’t understand why NG would be significantly higher.
Not to HJ the thread, but...maybe I'm way off. $2.00/ft would be nice. In SK I'm getting info of it being $20-30/ft, plus an $80 permit and materials. At 100ft I was thinking $2K would on tbe low side. Maybe I'll call tomorrow for a quote.
 

pcmeiners

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Saw e. bill for Michigan electric use was like $60 and the delivery/ demand charge was $230
Come on fjtter30 you can't use that to justify you comment on electric cost, a specific odd bill?

Electric national average kilowatt cost this year appears to be .18-.19, make it $.185, so roughly with an efficient
HP with a COP of 3.5 it cost $.053 per KW ; COP 3.5 is now an average in new efficient HP. Now by the end of this year the newest HPs with likely be up to a COP=4
 
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finn

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Come on fjtter30 you can't use that to justify you comment on electric cost, a specific odd bill?

Electric national average kilowatt cost this year appears to be .18-.19, make it $.185, so roughly with an efficient
HP with a COP of 3.5 it cost $.053 per KW ; COP 3.5 is now an average in new efficient HP. Now by the end of this year the newest HPs with likely be up to a COP=4
Michigan is a big state.

Our electric rate was just under $.29 /kwh last I checked.

I’m afraid to check again.
 

finn

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Not to HJ the thread, but...maybe I'm way off. $2.00/ft would be nice. In SK I'm getting info of it being $20-30/ft, plus an $80 permit and materials. At 100ft I was thinking $2K would on tbe low side. Maybe I'll call tomorrow for a quote.
Your quote is in Canadian dollars, so it’s probably the same after figuring the exch rate in.


Just kidding.

I’m a provacateur.
 

jblnut

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I’ll be honest and admit I didn’t read every single post …..

I live West of St. Cloud. I have a 2-ton Fujitsu mini split rated to -15f in my 54x72x18 farm shop and I love it. I use it to keep the shop at 55f until the water in my wood boiler cools off to 36f and I fire up the boiler and shut off the mini split.

I ran it all summer to keep it around 70f and honestly didn’t notice it on my power bill. I don’t know if I’d be okay with only one source of heat in a building I wanted heated here in MN. Even though it’s well insulated things cool off quickly when it’s -20f and windy.
 
OP
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I've settled on a mini split. After consideration, my main concern with running natural gas to the garage is that it would require a licensed plumber to do if I want to go the permit route- which I do, just to stay above board.

The new Blueridge XS6 model, which I believe is a rebadged Gree Sapphire, is comparable to top of the line Mitsubishi and Fujitsu models. The good thing about Blueridge is that they will warranty DIY work without any certs or licenses, and have great technical support.



The downside is that it does not come with as a DIY kit, the upside is that it's only $100 to rent all the tools necessary to do the evac. I already have a nitrogen tank and regulator for cold brew coffee, so I'll be able to go the extra mile with the triple evac.


Regarding wood shop dust, I already planned to build out a dust collection hose system to make cleanup easier, but that won't capture airborne particles. I'm going to install something like this to run while I'm out there working and be sure to be diligent about keeping the mini split's air filter clean.

 

pembol

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I've settled on a mini split. After consideration, my main concern with running natural gas to the garage is that it would require a licensed plumber to do if I want to go the permit route- which I do, just to stay above board.

The new Blueridge XS6 model, which I believe is a rebadged Gree Sapphire, is comparable to top of the line Mitsubishi and Fujitsu models. The good thing about Blueridge is that they will warranty DIY work without any certs or licenses, and have great technical support.



The downside is that it does not come with as a DIY kit, the upside is that it's only $100 to rent all the tools necessary to do the evac. I already have a nitrogen tank and regulator for cold brew coffee, so I'll be able to go the extra mile with the triple evac.


Regarding wood shop dust, I already planned to build out a dust collection hose system to make cleanup easier, but that won't capture airborne particles. I'm going to install something like this to run while I'm out there working and be sure to be diligent about keeping the mini split's air filter clean.

I think that is actually a rebranded Midea unit - that's not a bad thing, they are a huge OEM and are also make units for big names like Carrier.
 
OP
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I think that is actually a rebranded Midea unit - that's not a bad thing, they are a huge OEM and are also make units for big names like Carrier.

It's hard to keep track of which rebrands are which! But from my research, Midea and Gree are two of the best of the Chinese heat pump manufacturers, so regardless and as you point out it's still going to be a well made unit.
 
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pcmeiners

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Just sent this to AHRI, curious if I get any answer.......

"Who is or are your independent lab(s) who verify HVAC systems?
Why are they not cited with published certificates?
Why do some certs have data which is impossible to believe.?
Why is it that manufacturers do not follow a specific form and are not mandated to perform testing at specific temperatures under the same conditions.
Why are manufactures allowed to publish certificates with extremely little data?

Paul Meiners"

Update.... received no answer, guess they want credibility equal to JD Powers and Associates
 
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OP
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As governments start to push consumers away from natural gas and towards electric appliances I wonder if we will see something comparable to UL spring up for HVAC, and then municipalities will start requiring "listed" units to be installed for permitting.
 

WisJim

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The minimum setpoint on minisplits has always been a major disappointment for me. I wouldn't want it 62* when working in there let alone to leave it there all the time.

Another consideration with a minisplit is cleaning. The heads are not very fun to try to keep dirt and dust out of
Our Fujitsu units had a minimum setting for heating of 50F, and the filter in the head worked well and the whole thing was easy to clean and inspect. And they put out good heat well below zero, maybe minus 15.
They may not all work that well and the info about lowest heating set points, etc., can be hard to find in the literature.
 

danski0224

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Detached garage with approximately 700 sqft. I'm working on insulating it with mineral wool in the walls (R15) and blown in cellulose in the attic (haven't decided yet, but will probably just go for the full R49). Also going to insulate the garage door and air seal everything to the best of my ability.
It really comes down to what the load calculation is for the space, and then if whatever piece of equipment that you choose has at least that many btu's of rated output at the design temperature.
 

theoldwizard1

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Seeing as someone else resurrected this thread ...
  • I wonder what the OP chose ?
  • Some hp manufactures are starting to offer units that make hot water, for both domestic use and in-floor heating, and air handlers. Great combination !
 

jblnut

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Seeing as someone else resurrected this thread ...
  • I wonder what the OP chose ?
  • Some hp manufactures are starting to offer units that make hot water, for both domestic use and in-floor heating, and air handlers. Great combination !
Seems like he answered that already 🤷‍♂️

I've settled on a mini split. After consideration, my main concern with running natural gas to the garage is that it would require a licensed plumber to do if I want to go the permit route- which I do, just to stay above board.

The new Blueridge XS6 model, which I believe is a rebadged Gree Sapphire, is comparable to top of the line Mitsubishi and Fujitsu models. The good thing about Blueridge is that they will warranty DIY work without any certs or licenses, and have great technical support.



The downside is that it does not come with as a DIY kit, the upside is that it's only $100 to rent all the tools necessary to do the evac. I already have a nitrogen tank and regulator for cold brew coffee, so I'll be able to go the extra mile with the triple evac.


Regarding wood shop dust, I already planned to build out a dust collection hose system to make cleanup easier, but that won't capture airborne particles. I'm going to install something like this to run while I'm out there working and be sure to be diligent about keeping the mini split's air filter clean.

 

pcmeiners

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The new Blueridge XS6 model, which I believe is a rebadged Gree Sapphire, is comparable to top of the line Mitsubishi and Fujitsu models.
How do you state the XS6 is comparable to the top contenders ?, as you really do not have any data to go by. The certificate shows no useful data to compare to anything, it appears they used region IV ( with no other data, high or low temperate data), a mild south region, easy to produce good heat and cooling efficiency results with most splits.
From my research there is no useful high or low temperature data data just opinions. The AHRI certificate is BS, if the touted efficiency were legit you would think the company would be proud to include it in the AHRI cert. If I was testing/producing an AHRI cert you could not keep me from publishing the full data of the test result...if the results were good.
 
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PAndaemonium89

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Also in MN, I just bought a 24k Senville aura unit for 700sqft garage. Probably oversized for the space, but I was more concerned about heat than cooling. TBD on performance once I get it installed
 
OP
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Hey fellas,

OP here just giving an update. I'm going to start my garage project in June- insulation, paneling, electrical. I have two weeks off between jobs that I'm gonna spend trying to get the garage as finished as possible.

So I AM sticking with a mini split, and it's actually going to be more cost effective than I originally planned. My utility has a winter rate that HALVES electric cost if your primary heat is electric. This garage will have its own meter/service, so it will apply. $0.065/kwh in the winter. Before it was about 10% cheaper than nat gas, so yeah I'm even more committed to the mini split now.

I paid for a Manual J calculation and I'm tinkering with the design temps to determine if I need an 18k or 24k. I'm hovering between the Blue Ridge XS6 and XS5 models. The XS6 is their newest hyper efficient model but it only goes up to 18k and I'm worried it may not have enough oomf for deep winter. The manual J calc defaults to -8F outdoor and 70 indoor, I'm not sure if it's practical for unit selection.
 

pcmeiners

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Switchgar, my garage is 1080 sqft, standard i insulation, 10ft ceiling, 2 rollup doors. Have two 12k Fujitsu splits, one has never been turned on, the other 12k has heated and cooled from -7 to 101 °F no problem. 24k with even standard insulation is more than needed, unless your going to leave you roll up open.
 
OP
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Switchgar, my garage is 1080 sqft, standard i insulation, 10ft ceiling, 2 rollup doors. Have two 12k Fujitsu splits, one has never been turned on, the other 12k has heated and cooled from -7 to 101 °F no problem. 24k with even standard insulation is more than needed, unless your going to leave you roll up open.

Is your slab insulated? The manual J app I used indicates 40% of my heat loss is through the floor lol. The concern with my zone is that -7F isn't just some one off winter storm, it could be most of January.

I've been reading up on Senville units, they are the exact same as the Blue Ridge units (made by Midea) but $600-800 cheaper. So it's basically now down to a 24k Senville Aura or 18k Elite.

I made a spreadsheet just to quickly compare all the contenders. Since I'm worried more about heating, that's the performance I was looking at. I'm leaning towards the 18k Elite because it has a higher 5F BTU output and also is substantially more efficient, especially around the 47F range. 22k BTU heat output @5F with a COP of 2.34 is nuts.

 
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