Between 705 & 1200 SQ/FT The Texas Barn in PA
- Thread starter madison069
- Start date
Workspaces between 705 and 1200 squarefeet.
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madison069
Well-known member
He’s the second cat I’ve had with polydactyl, the first one we named Big Foot as I am a big fan of the Big Foot monster truck. Unfortunately he didn’t live long for some reason. I was in college when he passed at my parents house. They just found him dead one day.
Garold has been sleeping in the bed with me and sometimes I’ll find him on my pillow laying against my head! One night I found him sleeping on top of my torso! Makes it difficult to go to the bathroom when a cat is laying on you!
Mr onetwo
Well-known member
Big fan of orange cats in spite of only having 1 brain cell
OP
madison069
Well-known member
I need more clamps!
Along with this shows the condition of the Texas Barn currently, it’s crowded in there. Slowly I’m getting stuff out of there and getting some room to work on organizing the Texas Barn.
Along with this shows the condition of the Texas Barn currently, it’s crowded in there. Slowly I’m getting stuff out of there and getting some room to work on organizing the Texas Barn.
No matter how many you buy, you will never have enough.
I am a fan of the blue Pittsburgh quick release bar clamps from Harbor Freight. They are pretty darn good clamps, especially at the price.
I did take the time to super glue the pads onto them when I got them home. A common complaint is that they like to slip off. Gluing them on has worked so far - haven't lost one yet.
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madison069
Well-known member
I do like the prices of those clamps, I’ll have to look into them!
M.Brane
ALLIANCE MEMBER
"I have way too many clamps!"
- No one ever
- No one ever
OutlawDrifter
Well-known member
It's kind of like horsepower...I've been in circumstances where I didn't have enough, but never when I thought I had too much!
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madison069
Well-known member
I wonder what 900hp in a pinto would be like?
gearhead1960
ALLIANCE MEMBER
It would be a helluva ride…I wonder what 900hp in a pinto would be like?
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madison069
Well-known member
With so much stuff going on and I need the room in the barn, I decided to forfeit the sealer on the bunker floor. So I started putting stuff in the bunker and organizing it.
One of the things to go in the bunker was the scaffold. I figured when I’m not using it, it would make a good shelf!
I had maybe 3/4” between the uprights and the steel decking.
Need to hang some of the stuff between the beams but I also have 3 cabinets that I need to bring down here. But with a little more organizing there will be plenty of room down here.
That’s all I was able to achieve today between all of the little stuff in the house and sport activities.
One of the things to go in the bunker was the scaffold. I figured when I’m not using it, it would make a good shelf!
I had maybe 3/4” between the uprights and the steel decking.
Need to hang some of the stuff between the beams but I also have 3 cabinets that I need to bring down here. But with a little more organizing there will be plenty of room down here.
That’s all I was able to achieve today between all of the little stuff in the house and sport activities.
larry4406
Well-known member
Not sure I would be comfortable storing propane tanks and gas cans down there...With so much stuff going on and I need the room in the barn, I decided to forfeit the sealer on the bunker floor. So I started putting stuff in the bunker and organizing it.
One of the things to go in the bunker was the scaffold. I figured when I’m not using it, it would make a good shelf!
I had maybe 3/4” between the uprights and the steel decking.
Need to hang some of the stuff between the beams but I also have 3 cabinets that I need to bring down here. But with a little more organizing there will be plenty of room down here.
That’s all I was able to achieve today between all of the little stuff in the house and sport activities.
Whats in that black square bag in the next to last pic?With so much stuff going on and I need the room in the barn, I decided to forfeit the sealer on the bunker floor. So I started putting stuff in the bunker and organizing it.
One of the things to go in the bunker was the scaffold. I figured when I’m not using it, it would make a good shelf!
I had maybe 3/4” between the uprights and the steel decking.
Need to hang some of the stuff between the beams but I also have 3 cabinets that I need to bring down here. But with a little more organizing there will be plenty of room down here.
That’s all I was able to achieve today between all of the little stuff in the house and sport activities.
OP
madison069
Well-known member
My ******** boards, they are very nice so I wanted to protect them so I got the black bag.
OP
madison069
Well-known member
The plans are to store propane and gas cans in the Flammable cabinet I got a while back. That should protect them and keep the bunker safe.
*** after some reading, guess I’ll just put the tanks in the shed since it’s away from the house and it’s not a sealed environment. I just don’t want to leave it outside in direct sunlight cause that’s just stupid. I’ve seen too many tanks pop due to the heat from West Texas sun that you didn’t leave them outside for sure.****
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SilverJimmy
Well-known member
An old customer gave me these a couple years ago (remember, I suffer from Good-Deal-Itis!) and I’m planning on painting them the same color as my new shop.
I’m going to cover up all the extra holes cuz I don’t want a wasp hotel and then I’m going to place them on the north end of my shop that will never see the sun. This is where I’m going to store my gas cans and propane tanks, should be a good place and no big boom!
I’m going to cover up all the extra holes cuz I don’t want a wasp hotel and then I’m going to place them on the north end of my shop that will never see the sun. This is where I’m going to store my gas cans and propane tanks, should be a good place and no big boom!
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madison069
Well-known member
I tried out my idea of storing the roof cargo box.
Worked out nicely, might move it later but atleast I know it works.
Worked out nicely, might move it later but atleast I know it works.
Slick!
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madison069
Well-known member
Reading osha standards, they don’t allow propane to be stored in closed spaces. Hence why the propane tanks are store in expanded metal cages at the store. Then again they have those propane storage area right against the building which is a no-no in osha book due to needing to be 20ft away from the building. Honestly, I’m leaning toward those rules are just over bearing. I get that propane is heavier than air so it would accumulate in the bunker. So is gasoline vapor, but I just have to draw the line somewhere. Starting to think that I’m not going to be using the flammable cabinet since any idea I had is not really allowed. I’ll just hoard all of the flammable stuff that’s in tanks or jugs in the shed that’s away from the house and barn and just let it be. If the shed goes up in flames, it should be a good show!An old customer gave me these a couple years ago (remember, I suffer from Good-Deal-Itis!) and I’m planning on painting them the same color as my new shop.
I’m going to cover up all the extra holes cuz I don’t want a wasp hotel and then I’m going to place them on the north end of my shop that will never see the sun. This is where I’m going to store my gas cans and propane tanks, should be a good place and no big boom!
larry4406
Well-known member
Caged lean-to shelter with roof on backside of garage/bunker with locked door?
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madison069
Well-known member
Thought that but one of the thing mentioned is:
Key OSHA Propane Storage Requirements
- Location: Store containers outdoors, away from buildings, exits, stairways, and areas where people gather.
So per that statement it shouldn’t be near the barn.
While the shed on the other hand, is minimally 20ft away from house and barn, not sealed, shaded, and lockable. Plus if it goes up in flames I'm not gonna cry about it or have to call insurance company for a claim. I’ll just pull out some marshmallows and enjoy the fire.
Not to be the guy who says "aCtUaLlY...", but I guess I'll be that guy (I'll try to be a little less dickish though). First, OSHA regs have no bearing on how you decide to store propane on your private property. There is a reason they exist though, so using them as a guide is not a bad idea. It really just comes down to making sure that gas can't pool in an enclosed space.
You are, in fact, allowed to store propane inside a building, at least in an industrial setting. It all has to do with the volume of gas stored, ventilation, square footage of the building, and proximity to ignition sources. I know that there are also a separate set of rules for tanks intended for retail sale, although I've never had a need to read through that section. On that note, I would just say that if the fire marshals across the country haven't thrown a fit about where the cages are at in proximity to the buildings, then they are likely in compliance with the regs.
I wouldn't say that storing a couple of tanks in the bunker is the end of the world, but it could create a hazard, which you are already aware of. However, if you are going to be in and out of the bunker a few times a week to access equipment and items in storage, I personally would not have any concerns about it. I also don't think you need to buy/build a special cage and locate it a certain number of feet away from any structures on your property. Storing it in the shed, assuming it's not a massive inconvenience, is a perfectly good solution.
Regarding flammable storage cabinets, it's important to remember that their purpose is not to protect you from a fire or capture vapors/gas, it's to protect the contents of the cabinet from a fire/sparks/ignition. Having a flammable cabinet in the home shop is a great idea, especially if you are doing metal fab and creating sparks. Leave the vent plugs in place. Again, private property, you don't need to worry about local regs. In fact, the NFPA recommends the plugs stay in place whenever possible. If you do vent, it should be piped outside the building.
EDIT:
Also, 29 CFR 1910.110 has different rules regarding how to safely handle and store propane in a variety of different scenarios. I would not trust an AI summary or internet slop reposting site to give accurate information. What is acceptable in one situation may not be in another and can be conflated easily if you aren't reading carefully.
You are, in fact, allowed to store propane inside a building, at least in an industrial setting. It all has to do with the volume of gas stored, ventilation, square footage of the building, and proximity to ignition sources. I know that there are also a separate set of rules for tanks intended for retail sale, although I've never had a need to read through that section. On that note, I would just say that if the fire marshals across the country haven't thrown a fit about where the cages are at in proximity to the buildings, then they are likely in compliance with the regs.
I wouldn't say that storing a couple of tanks in the bunker is the end of the world, but it could create a hazard, which you are already aware of. However, if you are going to be in and out of the bunker a few times a week to access equipment and items in storage, I personally would not have any concerns about it. I also don't think you need to buy/build a special cage and locate it a certain number of feet away from any structures on your property. Storing it in the shed, assuming it's not a massive inconvenience, is a perfectly good solution.
Regarding flammable storage cabinets, it's important to remember that their purpose is not to protect you from a fire or capture vapors/gas, it's to protect the contents of the cabinet from a fire/sparks/ignition. Having a flammable cabinet in the home shop is a great idea, especially if you are doing metal fab and creating sparks. Leave the vent plugs in place. Again, private property, you don't need to worry about local regs. In fact, the NFPA recommends the plugs stay in place whenever possible. If you do vent, it should be piped outside the building.
EDIT:
Also, 29 CFR 1910.110 has different rules regarding how to safely handle and store propane in a variety of different scenarios. I would not trust an AI summary or internet slop reposting site to give accurate information. What is acceptable in one situation may not be in another and can be conflated easily if you aren't reading carefully.
OP
madison069
Well-known member
Go ahead and be that guy, I'm just reading and thinking here from a logical point to try to ensure I'm not creating a dangerous situation.
It's not a big inconvenience to put the extra propane tanks and gas cans in the shed as they are extra. Honestly the two propane tanks that's in the bunker is there just because I was tired of them being in the way in the main garage and the shed is a mess currently. The bunker has one constant spark source I can think of and it's the air compressor. The other sources would be if I started an equipment in the bunker but most likely that would only be the riding mower maybe if I do store it down there. Luckily, we installed two vent grates on the exterior walls of the bunker so there's constant air movement and I'm not sure how tight the doors will be once I build the doors for the bunker.
I figured the fire marshal would of said something regarding the placement of the propane tanks storage at retail stores if it was an issue. But if we are really worried about tank exploding randomly then against a building isn't wise either.
Nonetheless, I think once the shed is cleared out, the extra propane tanks will go in the shed with the extra gas cans. I'll just keep a 1lb propane bottle on the bench with a torch tip on it and an open bucket of gas for a place for the old timers to thump their cigarettes butts in. (just kidding)
Maybe I'll just keep the flammable cabinet in the barn and store the paints and related cleaners in there to protect them as they are pretty flammable but need to be in a semi temperature-controlled environment.
SilverJimmy
Well-known member
All the fire regs seem to be all about worse case scenarios, what could happen if all the bad happens all in the correct sequences. Case in point…. The firebox for my woodstove had to be 24” above the floor in my shop (code back when I built it) and it had to be that high so that combustible fumes would not be ignited so easily. I just figured the fire department wanted the shop to explode when fumes got that high and not be a fire they had to fight!
Having flammable stuff outside of an enclosed space makes sense if you are not in that area a lot, but I’m not going to keep my Oxy/Acetylene torches out in a shed, I’ll just keep an eye on them and make sure the valves are closed correctly when I’m not using them. I will store my propane and gas cans outside in those boxes and I going to add screened vents to them as that’s a good idea from you guys.
My father lived off the grid for a bunch of years and he made a cool shed for this stuff so that it was all secure and safe.
He was a metal building contractor so he used what he had to build it. Angle iron framing with ribbed sheet metal siding for the walls and the roof, and the gable ends were expanded metal screening for ventilation. This was up in the Northern California heavy forest and rarely saw any sunlight so it was never hot inside.
On your bunker with the floor being lower than the outside elevation you could treat it like a bilge in a boat. Get a bilge blower and have the hose pickup the floor air and vent it out the top. Turn it on a couple minutes before you do anything that might supply ignition. Works on a boat!
Having flammable stuff outside of an enclosed space makes sense if you are not in that area a lot, but I’m not going to keep my Oxy/Acetylene torches out in a shed, I’ll just keep an eye on them and make sure the valves are closed correctly when I’m not using them. I will store my propane and gas cans outside in those boxes and I going to add screened vents to them as that’s a good idea from you guys.
My father lived off the grid for a bunch of years and he made a cool shed for this stuff so that it was all secure and safe.
He was a metal building contractor so he used what he had to build it. Angle iron framing with ribbed sheet metal siding for the walls and the roof, and the gable ends were expanded metal screening for ventilation. This was up in the Northern California heavy forest and rarely saw any sunlight so it was never hot inside.
On your bunker with the floor being lower than the outside elevation you could treat it like a bilge in a boat. Get a bilge blower and have the hose pickup the floor air and vent it out the top. Turn it on a couple minutes before you do anything that might supply ignition. Works on a boat!
Mr onetwo
Well-known member
You could put one of these in the shed I suppose
www.1000bulbs.com
much ado about nothing....I have 3-100 gallon pigs right up against my garage and it is totally fine per NFPA 58 and the local authority. Make note that I am a licensed gas tech, although I am retired
Explosive Gas and Carbon Monoxide Alarm - Detects Propane and Methane Gas and/or CO Hazard
Utilize BRK's dual sensor explosive gas and carbon monoxide alarm, featuring digital display and a battery backup. Find more 120V detectors at 1000Bulbs.com!
much ado about nothing....I have 3-100 gallon pigs right up against my garage and it is totally fine per NFPA 58 and the local authority. Make note that I am a licensed gas tech, although I am retired
cccoltsicehockey
Well-known member
Damn, all this reading about propane has me thinking it has been a bad idea that I store my spare grill cyclinder in the house garage for the last 10 years. I figured it was better cause I was keeping it out of extreme heat.
It's fine, provided you aren't welding right next to it. You are likely in that space every day and would notice if there was a leak.
OP
madison069
Well-known member
You could put one of these in the shed I suppose
Explosive Gas and Carbon Monoxide Alarm - Detects Propane and Methane Gas and/or CO Hazard
Utilize BRK's dual sensor explosive gas and carbon monoxide alarm, featuring digital display and a battery backup. Find more 120V detectors at 1000Bulbs.com!
much ado about nothing....I have 3-100 gallon pigs right up against my garage and it is totally fine per NFPA 58 and the local authority. Make note that I am a licensed gas tech, although I am retired
I guess it's damn lucky that I haven't burnt a house or garage down. Welding near a gas can, yep. Burning tumbleweed nearby an oil battery tank, yep. Bucket full of gas nearby me while I was grinding and shooting sparks across the bucket, guilty.
Guess I got jaded in my past life working in the oil and gas industry. But as I got older, I started looking at safety stuff and trying to incorporate some of it in my life.
Is the whole propane conversation taking it to the extreme, yep. But at least we are thinking of all of the possibilities and what actions to take to migrate some of those risk. I wasn't really concerned about the tanks in the bunker as I mentioned there's lots of air flow from the 2 air vents and the wide-open doorway to the outside. But CAN the tanks leak and create a layer of fuel vapor in the bottom of the bunker, sure. Since I got the shed for storage also, it might be a better place for it anyway since the shed would be less accessed and the extra fuel won't be in my way when going in the bunker.
For me, it's come down to I'll just keep the extra fuel in the shed. But I'll have a 5-gallon gas can in the barn since I'm usually working on gas engines and need fuel often. I'll keep the other gas cans in the shed till I need them. Propane tanks will go in the shed also, but I'll keep a 1lb bottle on the bench for heating bolts and so on while the extra 3 flats of bottles with go in the shed. My other 2 tanks are located on the propane grill and fire pit cabinet which is where they will stay. My oxygen and acetylene bottles will stay in my cutting torch cart in the barn with the bottle valves shut off. My welding gas will stay on my welding cart with the bottle valve off when not in use. I think the flammable cabinet will get used for the paint supply and any other extra supply of flammable solvents while I keep one can out for use. I'll also have a fire extinguisher in the barn for oops moments. I got 2 fire extinguishers in the house, and I got two boat fire extinguishers floating around the barn that will be placed in the bunker most likely. Hopefully I'll be safe and prepared for any mishap.
OP
madison069
Well-known member
All the fire regs seem to be all about worse case scenarios, what could happen if all the bad happens all in the correct sequences. Case in point…. The firebox for my woodstove had to be 24” above the floor in my shop (code back when I built it) and it had to be that high so that combustible fumes would not be ignited so easily. I just figured the fire department wanted the shop to explode when fumes got that high and not be a fire they had to fight!
Having flammable stuff outside of an enclosed space makes sense if you are not in that area a lot, but I’m not going to keep my Oxy/Acetylene torches out in a shed, I’ll just keep an eye on them and make sure the valves are closed correctly when I’m not using them. I will store my propane and gas cans outside in those boxes and I going to add screened vents to them as that’s a good idea from you guys.
My father lived off the grid for a bunch of years and he made a cool shed for this stuff so that it was all secure and safe.
He was a metal building contractor so he used what he had to build it. Angle iron framing with ribbed sheet metal siding for the walls and the roof, and the gable ends were expanded metal screening for ventilation. This was up in the Northern California heavy forest and rarely saw any sunlight so it was never hot inside.
On your bunker with the floor being lower than the outside elevation you could treat it like a bilge in a boat. Get a bilge blower and have the hose pickup the floor air and vent it out the top. Turn it on a couple minutes before you do anything that might supply ignition. Works on a boat!
That shed reminds me of the sheds I played around as a child. Was just a ribbed tin siding small shed. The echo sound it made when I blew my bike tire up from putting too much air in it was loud! Hey! I was a kid who just got tired of filling his tire up often so figured I would just put extra air in it!
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madison069
Well-known member
Priorities right? They dictate what you’re gonna do first.
Well, I decided the TV needed to go up on the wall. Two reasons, first is to protect it from getting hit while moving stuff around the garage. Second, I need to get some music in the garage!
To get the big 75” tv up on the wall mount I installed an eye bolt in the ceiling joist and threaded a rope through it. Tied the rope to the tv brackets and then had my wife keep tension on the rope as I hoisted it up the wall. When I needed to readjust to push it higher, she was able to hold the rope tight while the tv just hung in the air! It worked out well, a lot better then I think if me and another guy were to man handle it up the mount as it’s pretty high and the tv isn’t light.
Here is the setup before hoisting it up,
And up on the mount!
I left the eye bolt in place for future me if I ever need to swap for a newer TV.
Here it is from across the garage, looks small huh.
Now I need to find the remote,
. Guess it got lost in the move.
Another item checked off my list was how to handle a table top I had from my father in law and a vanity that my wife has nowhere to put it, but she wants to hold onto it as it was her grandma’s bedroom set. I was scared of damaging the vanity top as I planned to clean and modify my guns in this room and needed a table to do the work. So I stripped the table top down to make the underside flat and placed the vanity and filing cabinet in a way to accept the table top and properly support it. I need to put a leg in the back right corner but it seems very solid. I did place a liner between the table top and vanity to protect it.
I think furniture wise, we are basically done with moving them and so on. Now to keep organizing everything.
Well, I decided the TV needed to go up on the wall. Two reasons, first is to protect it from getting hit while moving stuff around the garage. Second, I need to get some music in the garage!
To get the big 75” tv up on the wall mount I installed an eye bolt in the ceiling joist and threaded a rope through it. Tied the rope to the tv brackets and then had my wife keep tension on the rope as I hoisted it up the wall. When I needed to readjust to push it higher, she was able to hold the rope tight while the tv just hung in the air! It worked out well, a lot better then I think if me and another guy were to man handle it up the mount as it’s pretty high and the tv isn’t light.
Here is the setup before hoisting it up,
And up on the mount!
I left the eye bolt in place for future me if I ever need to swap for a newer TV.
Here it is from across the garage, looks small huh.
Now I need to find the remote,
. Guess it got lost in the move.Another item checked off my list was how to handle a table top I had from my father in law and a vanity that my wife has nowhere to put it, but she wants to hold onto it as it was her grandma’s bedroom set. I was scared of damaging the vanity top as I planned to clean and modify my guns in this room and needed a table to do the work. So I stripped the table top down to make the underside flat and placed the vanity and filing cabinet in a way to accept the table top and properly support it. I need to put a leg in the back right corner but it seems very solid. I did place a liner between the table top and vanity to protect it.
I think furniture wise, we are basically done with moving them and so on. Now to keep organizing everything.
SilverJimmy
Well-known member
I have TV envy! My 65” TV is not worthy, it looks like the 19” TV I had in my first house!
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madison069
Well-known member
It’s strange how such a big tv will look so small in a large room. Also weight wise you feel the difference between a 46” that is easily lifted by one person, but add 29” more and it’s too heavy to lift!I have TV envy! My 65” TV is not worthy, it looks like the 19” TV I had in my first house!
SilverJimmy
Well-known member
I’m just glad nobody was filming while the wife and I wrassled that thing up there! If I ever get something bigger…. Break out the forklift!
cccoltsicehockey
Well-known member
I know it a shop TV but everyone on r/tvtoohigh is cringing right now. Having a TV and tunes in the shop is definitely a must. Hell, I turn the music on if I am in there for anything longer than 10min most days. Just feels weird without it.
My shop tv is getting upgraded this week, my only complaint is that it gets a glare from the lights out there. Im wondering if a mount with more angle to it would eliminate the glare?
cccoltsicehockey
Well-known member
It should help some, but picking an anti glare TV screen is always the best option. In the garage I was able to space it out between the lights instead of inline which helped. I didn't have that option for my small TV in the wood shop and it has a fairly bad glare problem, too.
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madison069
Well-known member
I use my tv for YouTube, music, movies, and sports. Usually I’ll tinker on stuff while the tv is on, watch the show and then piddle during commercials. I will most likely get a smaller screen for internet use.
As for tv too high, I had one at this height but smaller in size and it worked out well when I’m across the garage.
As for tv too high, I had one at this height but smaller in size and it worked out well when I’m across the garage.
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madison069
Well-known member
Buddy says Hi,
He sees everyone who comes into my office/study.
I was able to work on the barn some, which resulted in getting an area cleared for the camaro to be parked in soon.
Now to keep chipping away at the rest of the garage.
Been selling off stuff, tossing stuff, and organizing it. Been putting like things in piles, and hopefully once I get these piles setup I will have a better understanding of what I’m keeping and what else needs to really be tossed.
One good thing is the house is pretty much setup now. Just the computer room has totes of photos/scrapbooks/memory stuff that needs to be organized and decluttered. Attached garage is kinda like the barn, but it’s now mostly just house related tools and woodworking tools.
Atleast I got the upper living room setup furniture wise. I need to setup the entertainment stuff on the left of the fireplace.
I think I’m 1/2 way through eating the elephant.
He sees everyone who comes into my office/study.
I was able to work on the barn some, which resulted in getting an area cleared for the camaro to be parked in soon.
Now to keep chipping away at the rest of the garage.
Been selling off stuff, tossing stuff, and organizing it. Been putting like things in piles, and hopefully once I get these piles setup I will have a better understanding of what I’m keeping and what else needs to really be tossed.
One good thing is the house is pretty much setup now. Just the computer room has totes of photos/scrapbooks/memory stuff that needs to be organized and decluttered. Attached garage is kinda like the barn, but it’s now mostly just house related tools and woodworking tools.
Atleast I got the upper living room setup furniture wise. I need to setup the entertainment stuff on the left of the fireplace.
I think I’m 1/2 way through eating the elephant.
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madison069
Well-known member
Some reason I didn’t see this, thanks! What’s nice is I can set the strap at a height and then slide the cargo box into the strap hammock I created. Then I just slowly pull the straps til it’s tight against the steel deck. Since these are those clinch buckles they hold the straps at the right height while o place the cargo box into it.